On July 23, Jupiter co-founder Meow posted on social media that he would work with Irene Zhao to launch the meme coin metadata platform Asian Mom, and Jupiter DAO would receive 5% of the Asian Mom tokens. However, Irene Zhao, the partner of this experiment, was pointed out by ZachXBT as having participated in multiple project scams.
Related reading: Jupiter and Irene Zhao jointly launched a Meme and were ridiculed, and the past projects of Asian Mom were accused of fraud
The meme coin metadata platform mentioned by Meow is Jupiters new experiment, which aims to try new launch mechanisms to improve meme coin metadata to solve some major PvP problems in the current meme coin release metadata: including false widespread distribution, sniping, opaque development allocation, lying influencers, using development dumps for large-scale pre-sales, and so on.
This experiment itself is not surprising. The Jupiter community loves memes, and Meow has repeatedly expressed the hope that the popularity of memes will continue. He has also proposed the PPP concept (Player pump player, and the last participant wins), and is constantly trying new ways to promote PPP.
Although there are still many doubts since Meow first mentioned PPP, after all, it is almost a consensus that crypto is like a casino, not to mention memes, which are non-value coins that come and go quickly. Perhaps Asian mom is the solution that Jupiter has thought of to promote the PPP concept.
The project is a good one, but Irene Zhao, the partner, is a KOL who has participated in the Rug project many times. For a while, CT was full of accusations against Irene Zhao. ALL IN CLUB promptly held a space to eat melons, and even attracted Irene Zhao herself to respond on the microphone.
The guests participating in the space first briefly explained Irene Zhaos identity. After mentioning that she had rigged the meme coin, Irene Zhao suddenly opened the microphone to defend all her previous actions. Then the guests took turns to interrogate Irene Zhao. BlockBeats edited part of the content of the space as follows. For simplicity, the names of all questioners and guests are represented by question:
What did Irene Zhao do?
Question: Irene Zhao is Chinese and her ancestral home is Nanchang, Jiangxi. A friend of mine told me this. Her LinkedIn profile says that she studied at the National University of Singapore, but the details are unknown. I don’t know much about her. I first noticed her on the Konomi project. This project was originally launched in March 2021 and then listed on OKX on April 6.
It was a bull market at that time, and the whole market was very good, but it has been falling since it was launched, and the highest was 5 US dollars. Now it seems to be 0.01 or 0.02, and it has fallen by an unknown number of times. It is basically impossible to recover forever, even after it was listed on OKX, it has been falling all the way.
When I first started paying attention to Irene, she was the CMO of Konomi. Then I looked up some of her interview articles. She had done an MA before, and introduced Konomi with several of her classmates from the National University of Singapore. The details are unknown. I saw on LinkedIn that she graduated in 2016, which means she graduated three years earlier than me.
At first, she was doing mass trading, and then she became an Instagram KOL, posting beautiful photos of herself. Now, she has more than 500,000 followers on Instagram, but the number of likes doesn’t match the number of fans. Maybe one post only has a dozen likes, so these fans are probably bought, but I don’t know the details.
Lets talk about the Konomi project again. I have never been a CMO, so I dont know what the specific job of a CMO is. But she should have been the CMO at the end of 2021, which was the last bull market of the entire cryptocurrency. Her job is basically to publish some Konomi project updates, and then her own selfies. The views, likes, interactions, etc. of her selfies and project updates are very mismatched. Users still buy her looks, her sexiness and hotness, but they dont seem to be very interested in the projects she promotes.
In the crypto bull market, a coin should have increased in value. But after KONO went online, it never increased in value and continued to fall. Maybe people were not very interested in the KONO project, and she may have left at the end of 21. During that time, she changed her Twitter profile to say that she was building a socialfi project, but later changed it again.
I will talk about the three projects in my tweets . These three projects are all my real experiences, and there is no exaggeration. It’s just that these three projects coincidentally all ended up in the same place.
The second project is SIMP shared by ZachXBT, which means that she sent the unlocked tokens to DWF in advance. These tokens were supposed to be locked for one year, but DWF sold them right away. The trend of this token is the same as KONO, it has never risen and has been falling all the way to zero.
The third one is also something I experienced personally, it’s called IDK, the full name is I don’t know, it’s a meme coin on the Solana chain, I should have bought it in mid-May, when it rose to a maximum of 40 million, then I should have bought it at 25 million, and then I didn’t sell it at 40 million, and then it immediately fell back to 5 million.
Why do you frequently participate in Rug projects?
Irene Zhao: Everything I said when I bought IDK was told to me by the Dev (developer). I personally didn’t make a penny on this coin. It was the first meme coin I promoted. It was recommended to me by a very good friend. He told me that the team was awesome. Then I joined the community, and there were some other KOLs in it, so I thought this coin was pretty good. After all, this was my first time to accept a coin on Solana, so I agreed.
When IDK started to fall, they told me that someone was selling it to lower the price so that they could pull it up later. At that time, he said that it would rise the next day, and I believed him, but the next day he suddenly told me that he wanted to rig it, and it couldnt be saved. So I didnt think they would rig it from the beginning. As a KOL like me, there was no need to rig fans just to make such a small amount of money.
Here I need to mention another monkey coin on Solana that I promoted, MONKEY. I was also deceived and didn’t make a penny. He promised me that the coin would be valued at at least 100 million, or even several hundred million, and I believed him. I never sold a single coin from beginning to end. You can check my wallet. At most, I had about $60,000 but didn’t sell it.
Two or three days later, the introducer told me that he was in charge of the entire marketing business and told me My reputation is just a stupid meme coin, so please trust me, I wont Rug. I have all the chat screenshots and can show them to everyone later. Because this person is a friend of my friend, I believed it and promoted this coin.
At that time, Asianmom was very popular, so I suspected that he might have taken advantage of this and regarded my community as a harvest target, because he made some statements afterwards, and my friends on the chain read them and told me that this was a developers Rug. So I think my problem may be that I trust people too much.
To be honest, my circle of friends is relatively small, and I won’t meet strangers unless they are introduced by an acquaintance. But I trust my acquaintance very much, so they introduce some meme projects to me, and then I will promote them. But in fact, after experiencing MONKEY, I became very cautious and basically did not take on other meme projects.
So the conclusion is that I really didn’t want to Rug my community, I didn’t sell a single coin, and I didn’t make a penny on either project, otherwise I wouldn’t have come on the mic and explained it to everyone so sincerely. Later I asked that person if I needed to explain something for MONKEY? He told me not to explain, just delete the tweet, and I did. IDK is the same.
I have all the screenshots, and I can share them with everyone, including the entire situation in that group. The entire developer team suddenly said that Rug was broken and could not be saved. It may involve the privacy of some other KOLs, but this is completely true. I really dont need to damage my reputation for 10,000 or 20,000 yuan. I just trust people too easily.
Question: Do you mean that we retail investors have it all our own fault?
Irene Zhao: I didn’t mean that. I do have to admit that I made a mistake. I should have done better due diligence. So I became very careful later and basically stopped accepting such meme ads. Unless I believe that the project owner is awesome and has the ability to pull the price. So most of my problems are that I didn’t do a good job of due diligence, so I apologize to everyone here. I’m sorry to disappoint everyone. But I can’t control many things in this field. I can only tell you very sincerely that I didn’t make money from it, but I did not do a good job of due diligence in this regard.
Question: Why did you delete the tweet without any explanation about Rugs project?
Irene Zhao: I did lack communication. I know that next time I release any project, I will have to bear the consequences of being cut off, and I need to explain why this happened. But I chose to ignore it because I didn’t want to create more drama. Now I realize that I do have the responsibility to explain.
I want to say sorry to everyone here. I shouldnt end the recommendation of a project in this way of evasion or deleting the tweet. This is an irresponsible behavior. Especially based on the fact that I have so many fans, my fault is that I did not do my due diligence.
Question: The meme they promote should be different from the one you promote, right?
Irene Zhao: Okay, let’s not discuss whether others have promoted Rug’s mem. I admit that I was wrong about this promotion. I don’t say other KOLs are bad, and I don’t put the blame on others. It’s a fact that I was wrong.
Question: If you only earned marketing fees and market fees during the promotion process, everyone would be completely acceptable. Since you are not a participant, you can directly introduce Rug people and Rug project parties, including who made the money?
Irene Zhao: I really don’t know who made the money, just like in the current market, you don’t know who made the money, some people made money, and some people lost money. And I really don’t know whether the developer is capable enough or he is deliberately making trouble, I have no way to judge.
So I cant tell you who made the money. I can only say that the project didnt go as planned. I didnt say I was going to falsely promote a meme project. If I made money from a project or did marketing, I would be honest with you. If I made money, I made money. If I lost money, I lost money. I didnt need to lie.
Question: What is your income during this process?
Irene Zhao: Some projects may use SOL to pay for marketing fees, and some projects may give you some tokens as marketing fees. For example, MONKEY gave me 0.2% of the token supply. But I didnt sell it. I didnt say that I would sell it immediately after posting this tweet and let my fans take over. But it is true that after I finished promoting it, other people on this project may have dumped the market within three or four days, so the coins I had were reduced to zero.
Question: Have you ever worked again with a project team that you have previously Rug with?
Irene Zhao: No.
Question: Do you work directly with the team or through agency referrals?
Irene Zhao: I have never worked for an agency. I have always been contacted by individuals. I have never accepted any advertisements from any agency.
Question: Why do you trust them? Because most of the meme coins are Rug.
Irene Zhao: I trust them because the middleman is someone I trust very much, a friend I trust very much, and I have worked with him before. I got to know the project party through him, through an acquaintance.
Question: So you have many acquaintances who introduced different projects to you, and then all the different projects were Rug.
Irene Zhao: We are talking about two right now, one is IDK, and the other is MONKEY. I only have two memes, no others, these are the two people. And later I was very careful, you know, there are many people looking for me to promote every day, and when I was preparing to release Asian mom, I did not release any meme advertisements.
Because I still want to focus all my attention on our own meme. So you can see from my Twitter that I haven’t posted any advertisements this month. And many KOLs may post four or five memes a day. To be honest, I haven’t posted any promotions this month.
Question: Regarding the SIMP accused by ZachXBT, the transfer data on this chain is real, and some have a lock-up period of one year. Why did you sell it to DWF immediately?
Irene Zhao: That token did not come from our locked coins.
Question: So there is a wallet that transferred tens of millions of coins to DWF for no reason?
Irene Zhao: Those are all coins circulating in the market, and they are unlocked coins. They are not our teams tokens, but the coins of a certain system link in the tokens. Moreover, I will explain the DWF matter in the clarification, because this thing involves some of our and DWFs more private things, so I will issue a clarification.
Because this is a serious and huge accusation to me, I will explain it better in a text response rather than through space. It also involves some token economics, some data and facts, and some of our previous conversations and very specific plans, so I will put it in the clarification.
Where did the money earned by IreneDAO go?
Irene Zhao: IreneDAO is a completely free mint. I personally don’t have any IreneDAO NFTs. You can check my wallet and see that many of them were given away for free to some friends. We had some royalties at the time, about 5%. After that, we donated $100,000 to NTK trafficking (anti-trafficking organization) in Southeast Asia. There is evidence for all of this, and I can provide relevant proof.
Question: When did that happen?
Irene Zhao: Around February 2022, but it was on my Instagram account, and now I have cancelled the account, so I cant see it. But I have proof, everything is automatically recorded, and everything I say now is recorded.
Question: Where did the NIT royalty money go?
Irene Zhao: In addition to the $100,000 in royalties, a lot of funds are managed by multi-signature addresses, and I personally do not have the right to operate these funds alone. We have DAO members who receive salaries every month. Of course, this is also my problem, because they pay themselves a lot of salaries and then carry out related operations.
Question: Do you mean that you used the community’s money to pay yourself a salary?
Irene Zhao: The money was not given to me, I did not take it. I mean it was like the DAO members paying themselves wages, because I was a KOL at the time and did not have time to manage IreneDAO, so they had their own organization, and the DAO members used part of the money for some activities and some for other things every month. The money they took could track every expenditure, and not a penny went into my wallet.
Question: I can’t trace to whom the money was given.
Irene Zhao: The point of this discussion is that if I really want to make money by issuing NFTs, I can launch a new NFT project after IreneDAO, with each NFT worth 0.1 Ethereum. If I issue 10,000 NFTs, I can easily earn 1,000 Ethereum. But I don’t need to make money from royalties. At that time, I wanted to be a KOL and bring in all the great creators in Web2 through this form to build a Web2.5 platform. But it turns out that Web 2.5 narratives don’t work, and we really didn’t do it.
I am not making excuses, because at that time everyone was talking about the Web2.5 narrative and various collaborations, and actually spent a lot of money to make a market, but later it was proved that this barrier was too high. I have not touched the remaining assets on IreneDAO, because this is not a wallet, and I don’t have the final say. You can see that many multi-signature addresses are not signed by me.
Question: Could you please ask these DAO members to correct what you said?
Irene Zhao: This happened in 2022. I didn’t know many DAO members and I didn’t communicate with them privately. You can check their wallets. All transactions in the multi-signature address were not signed by me, so they paid their salaries without my knowledge. This was also my negligence because I had just entered the industry and had not found the best management model.
I entered the industry around March 2021, so I was really inexperienced at the time and didn’t run a DAO very well. Also, as a KOL, I didn’t have time to care about how the members spent their money.
Question: So you were actually doing volunteer work at that time?
Irene Zhao: I can’t say that. It did bring me a good brand, and we want to make this brand bigger. I don’t want to be the only one doing this, but I hope more creators can come in and do these things. So we focused more on Web2 creators and the top TikTok in Hollywood. We had a big territory at the time instead of just promoting ourselves.
Question: Does your activity involve any substantive work besides posting some sexy photos?
Irene Zhao: At that time, there was a DC administrator who often did some design work, but we may need to find someone from IreneDAO to explain what he did. But there are records of why he paid the money to those members to do these things.
Question: This is the first time I know that being a Discord administrator can make so much money. You mentioned that IreneDAO is free mint, so there is no income from this part. If a 5% royalty is extracted, the total transaction volume of about two to three days at the peak of NFT was 2,300 Ethereum. It was a bull market in the crypto industry and also a bull market for NFT. Therefore, these 2,300 Ethereums brought about 115 Ethereums. According to the price at the time, it was about 400,000 US dollars. You said that the $400,000 was used to pay wages, but you yourself got nothing, and they took your income.
Irene Zhao : We donated $100,000 and had about $300,000 left. They really wasted a lot of money.
Question: Who are these people? Are they your aliases?
Irene Zhao: It was someone I didn’t know, and I didn’t contact them directly. You can go to the blockchain to find those wallet addresses to see who is managing the entire DC community. It couldn’t be my smurf account, and I really didn’t have time to manage it at the time.
Question: Who are these people? Who are the people in your so-called multi-signature address? Do you really dare to give money to someone you don’t know?
Irene Zhao: I only know that there was a person who was in charge of IreneDAO at the time. He was paid by our company at the time. His name was Napoleon and he was in the United States. He was one of my employees, and I agreed to let him help me manage this DAO.
Question: So your employees took all your salary, and you as the boss didn’t make a penny?
Irene Zhao: If you don’t believe me, then what’s the point of this space? At that time, we didn’t want to make money through NFT.
How to become the CMO of Konomi?
Question: I said in the thread before that you were an unknown person, but later I found out that you should have been an influencer on Instagram at first, so it is more likely that you jumped directly from one industry to the cryptocurrency industry and became the CMO of a crypto project Konomi.
Irene Zhao: I was an Instagram influencer in Web2. I joined Konomi because it was a project of my friend, so I was helping my friend. He is someone I trust very much. We have been good friends since college. I joined the cryptocurrency industry because of him. And at that time, there was actually no such thing as a CMO. CMO was equivalent to a chief marketing officer.
I am not bragging, but it is true that the concept of CMO became popular after I did it. Why did I become popular? The reason is that many Crypto KOLs were my fans before Web2. At that time, the mechanism of Twitter was that if they commented on you, everyone could see it.
So although I was a newcomer in Web3 at the beginning, many big Vs already knew me, and they would often interact with me. So my fans grew very quickly at that time, and there were relatively few girls. I was like a bonus of an era, so I became popular quickly. There was no behind-the-scenes promoter, and there was no shady business.
I can tell you who they are. One of them is called Alex, a famous big V with about 100,000 followers. He was already famous in Crypto. You can see some of my earliest Twitters that I interacted with them. This is all natural growth. Of course, I admit that credibility is partly responsible, but you need to understand that Crypto has a culture. You need to see how they post memes and pay more attention to some of the languages they use. And I also have some fans in Singapore, and I will meet them offline in Singapore, so the number of fans will increase faster.
Question: This is not the first or second time that you have experienced Rug projects. You are a serious KOL and you want to grow together with these project parties. Why didn’t you come out to clarify it as soon as possible? You have the title of CMO in Konomi, why didn’t you come out to clarify it as soon as possible? As the CEO of a project, you must come out to find out who has Rug the money and where my money has gone.
But your answer is 7 points true and 3 points false. You pointed out an American named Napoleon under everyones urging, which seems to be made up. The key to this matter is how ruthlessly you cut the leeks, and what role you play in it? Did you treat retail investors like dogs, and did the money go into your pocket? From what I heard tonight, it is likely that you could have made a huge profit from this money, but you didnt get it all, so you are also wronged.
Irene Zhao: I didnt even know you were going to speak on the mic tonight. I didnt think about all the words in advance, and I didnt read anyones Twitter to see what accusations you had against me. I just happened to see Space and went on the mic, and I spoke the truth from beginning to end.
I think every KOL has his or her own style. My style is like what I just said. I will give a cold shoulder instead of explaining that I also lost money. Of course, this is also my problem. Because to be honest, even if I explain that I lost money, I can still act it out, right? Many KOLs post that they lost money, but they didn’t actually lose money. They made money, but they still acted like they lost money.
For me, I personally prefer the cold treatment, but after listening to everyones opinions today, I admit that this cold treatment method is very immature, I did not consider it, and I was not responsible enough. If I promote other projects in the future, and this project does not follow the direction I promised everyone, then I will explain with a very sincere attitude why this thing is Rug.
Jupiter Why did you choose to work with us?
Question: What do you think of the Jupiter team? I think the Jupiter team is smarter than you. They are now doing a meme Launchpad just to prove one thing: even if a controversial person issues a coin, I can make it very fair and transparent.
Irene Zhao: When Asian mom first became popular, Meow came to me and asked me if this project was mine. I told him that this project was a community project, and then I asked him whether he should do this project indoors or issue a new coin. He asked why he should do it indoors, because you don’t know who will issue the coin for this project, and you don’t know how this project came out in the beginning, and there is no specific information. If you easily adopt a meme coin, it is easy to Rug your fans.
Question: If I were the CEO of Jupiter and I chose you, then you will definitely be controversial, and if you come out to clarify now, you will only damage your own brand.
Irene Zhao: I think this idea is rather narrow-minded. If you think that Jupiter, as Solana’s first aggregator, would be willing to risk their reputation to cooperate with a “malicious” company just for marketing purposes, then I think you think too narrowly about Jupiter.
Question: Can you tell us some details about your collaboration with Jupiter?
Irene Zhao: We had been planning this basically a month ago. At first, he saw the community project, but I didn’t know the entire token supply distribution, nor did I know who held most of the chips, although they gave me 3%. But I haven’t sold a single coin so far. The highest point was about $3.3 million, and you can see it in my on-chain records. It would be irresponsible to promote it directly, and it was later confirmed that the project was a developer Rug.
Because when I mentioned the term Asian mom, there was buying and dumping. I dont have the specific details, but someone told me that this phenomenon was caused by the developers in Rug. So based on these facts, we decided to launch a new meme coin. He sent a tweet at the time, saying that he wanted to do a social experiment and airdrop some tokens to those who left their wallet addresses on his Twitter. This was something we came up with together.
This was our original intention, because he wanted to promote the concept of PPP, and he thought that my concept as an Asian mom was very good. And actually, it was exactly the opposite of what you said, the reason why he cooperated with me was that he thought I had been in this market for a long time and was a long-term player, and he didnt want to cooperate with a short-term player, so he chose me.
So, it is contrary to the original intention of using the malicious reverse proof mechanism that I just mentioned. I am very sincere and honest in saying these things to you. If I were making it up, I would not have so many details. I also cannot tell you these things with a complete set of logic, but this is indeed the reason why we started working together.
Question: Why did Jupiter choose you?
Irene Zhao: Because he liked the narrative of Asian mom very much at the time and thought it had great potential. It might be because the community had already posted an Asian mom for me, and it was quite popular at the time. And maybe I have been in the circle for a long time and have a certain fan base, so he thought it would be more suitable.
Question: Did Jupiters CEO choose this narrative because of his personal plot preferences?
Irene Zhao: He thought Asian mom was a good meta, and he liked the concept very much. Just as there was a mother in Europe and America at the time, he thought we in Asia could also have an Asian mother, and then he wondered if there could be a brand new narrative to expand the Asian mom. This was the original intention.
Because for Jupiter, it is not about making money. He is a person who likes to promote new ideas very much, so he thinks that if we can host this Meta, it will have a positive impact on the market, so it is something we do together.
Will the new meme platform be Rug?
Question: Can you tell me what you have gained from working with Jupiter?
Irene Zhao: First of all, I think they are a very good platform. I like this founder very much because he has his own ideas and can always bring new narratives to the entire blockchain. He is the best founder so far. By working with him and promoting the PPP concept, it is a very good brand building for me.
There are also financial incentives. My tokens have an 18-month lockup period. I have all the chat records to prove that we basically agreed on it a month ago. Because we havent had time to announce it yet, but all the token supply allocations are very open and transparent. So if this coin returns to zero after 18 months, then my income from this project will be very small.
But I think no matter what the benefits are, if through this cooperation, more meme coins can accept the PPP concept and learn from it, it will be a good thing. So I am willing to do such a thing. This is my original intention.
Question: After Asian Mom arrives at Jupiter, if the price of the currency does not perform well in the future, as a planner, will you cut yourself out again? How do you ensure that this project has a long-term positive effect?
Irene Zhao: First of all, I want to make it clear that I cannot guarantee the direction of the project, because we really don’t know what the market will be like in the future, but we can ensure that we lock the tokens. We have no pre-sale and no KOL distribution. We will give the tokens to some early supporters, and everything is open and transparent. We cannot control the direction, but we can ensure that there will be no Rug.
Because now many projects are being asked whether they can take off, some can indeed take off, but some projects fail to take off, or suddenly die after taking off, because others have rigged it, for example, all the developers have left, or they snapped 70% of the supply. So what we can do is to ensure that this does not happen to this new meme.
Question: Now Meow is looking for you to cooperate with them to use you for stress testing, to prove that there is no way to Rug even if a malicious node is involved. Don’t you realize this?
Irene Zhao: If this is really the case, then I can only say that I met the wrong person. If you really think so, then I don’t have anything to say, and we’ll see the result in the future, okay? Because I can tell you that I can’t convince you, and you can’t convince me, so we can each think that we hold the truth, there is no need to laugh at anyone, and there is no need to say that you are stupid or something like that in retrospect, it’s meaningless.
If I were a victim, I would not get angry immediately because we have all been through a lot. We would not get angry just because someone made a mistake and would not go crazy and put him online to curse and lash out at him because we are all mature people.
Question: Since public opinion is now in this (bad) direction, have you considered turning to another direction, or choosing a different path?
Irene Zhao: I believe in karma and reincarnation. I am participating in this space today and I admit my mistakes. Why is there such public opinion? I think it is a backlash, because it may be that I did not do a good job of post-processing when dealing with the problem before, which led to this outcome now. So I personally will not do such a thing again.
And to be honest, I want to work in this industry for a long time. I don’t want to make a lot of money and then run away, because it’s meaningless. What can I do? I talked to many friends and asked them, “You make a lot of money, what do you want to do?” You have nothing else to do, because in other industries you can’t develop so fast, you can’t have so many opportunities, and you can’t have new stories every day. Or maybe my influence in other industries may not be as great as in blockchain.
I think I would like to do this in the long term, so I can voluntarily lock up my meme coins for 18 months, and I dont want to make a big Rug, and then I will run away, because I have nothing else to do. This is the truth, so I like this industry very much, I think it can bring that kind of freshness and excitement, and I also want to see what this project can do.
Question: Asian mom, do you want to make money or gain fame? If you want to restore your reputation, what can you do?
Irene Zhao: We will have a very transparent mechanism, and all the specific things are open and transparent, to ensure that there will be no early unlocking of tokens, or situations such as creating different communities by ourselves. We will ensure, or Jupiter will ensure, that this will not happen.
So, do I want fame or money? I think at this stage, fame is very important to me. And I have said that my tokens are locked for 18 months. So whether I can make money depends on how the project develops in the end, whether we and the community can do this well, and that is the factor that determines whether I can make money.
I really dont know if I can make money, but I can ensure that I wont do anything, so my reputation wont be damaged because of this, but I cant ensure where it will go.
